93. What is the Secret to a Successful Writing Process?

There is power in the written word. Words can cut like swords, heal like salve, and preserve like stone.  We don't question the power of writing... but we do wonder if there's a secret to the writing process. After all, most writers know that as satisfying as finishing a piece of writing can be, the process is often fraught with frustration. 

In this episode of Christian Curious, we chat with Dr. Doug Groothuis. He's written 15 books and published in several papers. So, we thought he'd know a few things about writing (such as how to stay in your chair to write when the mountains are calling your name.)

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Transcript

WHAT IS THE SECRET TO A SUCCESSFUL WRITING PROCESS?

There is power in the written word. Words can cut like swords, heal like salve, and preserve like stone. As a writer professor for many years, as well as a writer myself, I know that writing is hard—even for those who do it well. 

In this Christian Curious interview, we speak with Dr. Doug Groothuis about the writing process. Dr. Groothuis is an apologist and author of several published papers and fifteen books.

Shownotes

Dr. Halee [1:17]: You have come up with so many different books, articles, and papers. I want to pick your brain about the writing process. I think there are a lot of people who know there is value in writing, but they don’t know how to accomplish it. Today, we’re doing something a little bit different. Instead of me coming up with questions, you asked your followers on Facebook what questions they have about your writing process.

The first one-- do you write every day?

Dr. Groothuis [2:15]:

Pretty much. I feel kind of empty and meaningless if I don’t write at least something every day. I’m always thinking about issues; I’m reflecting on my studies, teachings, and preachings. I basically never stop thinking, and I think in terms of how I would write something. Every day, I write a few hundred words. However, sometimes it’s way more than that.

Dr. Halee [3:07]:

How do you discipline yourself? Is there a certain number of words you strive for, or do you let inspiration more you?

Dr. Groothuis [3:20]:

I think it’s both. If I’m writing a book, I might have a limit of 60,000 words like I did for Fire in the Streets. I was so motivated to write that book that I wrote 100,000 words in hopes that they would lengthen the book. They replied and said, “It’s all very good, but we need you to get it down to 60,000.” So, I got it down to 60,000 in 24 hours. I knew exactly what to cut. However, I was able to publish most of what I cut out in other places. So, I was really on a tear with Fire in the Streets. I have never written a book so quickly with so much passion. 

[4:13] Dr. Halee:

How long did it take you?

[4:16] Dr. Groothuis:

About four months.

[4:17] Dr. Halee: 

That’s amazing.

[4:18] Dr. Groothuis:

Yeah, I was kind of amazing with myself. The last weekend before the deadline I worked 14 hours on Saturday and 6 hours on Sunday. My wife and dog would come downstairs and peek at me. You know this idea of the flow state that psychologists talk about? I just got into a flow state with the book. 

But that’s not always true. Some things take a lot more time and happen a lot more slowly. I’m 65 now, and most things that I write about come to me fairly quickly. That would not have been true 30 years ago.

Dr. Halee [4:55] 

Why do you think that is?

 Dr. Groothuis [4:56]

I think it’s experience. I have the basic abilities down—I don’t want to sound cocky—but now I don’t have to make outlines when I write. I have the outline pretty much in my mind. I might make a few notes on my document, but it’s pretty much there. I don’t struggle to much about how I’m going to put things. Of course, I revise. However, I also have to say that my skills as a writer were honed and made much better by my first wife, Rebecca Merrill Groothuis, who was a writer (two books and many articles) and editor herself. She passed away four years ago. She edited all my books through the First Edition of Christian Apologetics. After that, the dementia kicked in and she was not able to edit anymore. So, when I write anything, I often concentrate and think, “How would Becky make this sentence better?” I really want to salute her. I miss her in many ways, though I am now happily remarried. But I miss Becky the editor. I would go with 98 percent of her edits. Occasionally I would disagree, but almost never.

Dr. Halee [6:36]

She was a fantastic writer. I’ve read her work. Another question someone asked is do you listen to music when you write, or does it distract you? If you do, what kind is it and why?

Dr. Groothuis [6:49]

No, I don’t listen to music while I’m writing. I will sometimes listen to music when I’m reading or studying. It’s usually jazz, and I find that I can’t read if the music has words. Because I’m reading words and I’m hearing words, and there’s a conflict. I can’t give proper attention to the words that I’m reading. I always write with as much silence as I can. I do a lot of writing during the summers in Alaska in the loft. My wife might be listening to something in the floor beneath us, and there’s no wall. I really need silence, so I’ll put on my headphones and listen to white noise so I can put my psychological energy into the writing without distractions. Some people love to go to Starbucks or a tea shop to write, and I just think, “What world do you live in?” 

Dr. Halee [7:57]

Yeah, I can’t do that.

Dr. Groothuis [7:59]

Some people can, and that’s fine. What people often say about writing is “find what works for you.” I don’t want to be a total relativist. First, I think writers should ask themselves “What should I write that needs to be said?” Then, “Am I skilled enough, and do I have the knowledge to bring it about?” Many things that are written and published should not be. They are fluff, or they’re wrong and they’re stupid. I’ve wrote a lot of stupid things over the years. So, the first question writers should as is “Do I have something true, rational, and significant to say to the world?” It’s not, “I need to express myself.” Unless it’s a personal journal; that’s fine. But if you just want to hurl something into the world with your name on it, then you need to back it up with facts, logic, and a decent style of writing. 

Dr. Halee [8:59]

And you know, that demands a certain quality of character. I think it even demands a certain experience of support and encouragement. I know there are writers out there 

As a female Christian writer, it can be very hard to sit down and express what you believe to be true. You know that people are going to come after you hard, and they’ll come after you harder because you are a female Christian writer. I wonder sometimes about the confidence factor of being able to produce so much work. Our confidence level can hinder our creativity.

Dr. Groothuis [10:00]

To be a great writer requires humility and courage. The humility is that I need to know what I’m writing about, and I should not overestimate myself. I need to learn from others in order to write anything worthwhile. In addition, you need the courage to release it to the world. If you get published in a magazine, book, journal, or online, you are offering your ideas to the world to ignore (which is the worst), to be appreciated, or to be attacked. I have had a lot of people misinterpret what I’ve written or attack a straw man. My first wife wrote on a very controversial issue, which is the role of women in the church and the home. Many people who critiqued her didn’t even understand her argument! She was very patient and would go back and read their criticisms. She would respond very carefully and would never let a criticism go unheated. She was very meticulous about that. But she got plenty of criticisms. She got the “well, you’re not a biblical scholar” criticism, which is just ad hominem. Deal with her arguments! So, you have to have thick skin as a writer and be willing to realize that sometimes the critics are right. If they’re right, admit it. Change it in the second edition of the book, or don’t teach it that way anymore. 

Dr. Halee [11:50]

I think that’s a really important point—sometimes critics are right! Humbly accept that. That can be a huge lesson to learn, especially when everybody thinks that my truth is my truth and your truth is your truth. Maybe sometimes the critique is fair! 

Another question I have is “How do you stay in your chair?” When I was writing my book this winter, I would look out my cabin window and see this mountain. I would look at that beautiful mountain and think, “Gosh, I want to be climbing that mountain, not writing this book!” I recently revisited that mountain as a personal retreat, and I went to the front desk to ask where the trailhead is. The receptionist said, “That’s Deer Creek Mountain.” I realized I had already climbed that mountain! That really struck me—I was tormented all winter by a mountain I’ve already climbed. 

So, I don’t want to stay in my chair all the time. How do you stay in your chair?

Dr. Groothuis [13:06]

I love books, and I write in my basement. I have a particular place that I write in, and that’s my happy place. I’m surrounded by books, and I can always escape to be with my wife. And I don’t only write…I have a social life and I like to ride my bicycle and go to jazz concerts. But with this cranky 65-year-old body, I can still sit and write for long periods of time—getting up is another thing. I get immersed in the ideas, and the ideas carry me along. 

Dr. Halee [14:28]

So, where do you get your ideas?

Dr. Groothuis [14:29]

That’s a pretty deep and philosophical question! Ultimately, all of the good and true ideas come from God because “good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows.” (James 1:17) My ideas come from my life of reading, studying, teaching, and previous writings. I’ve had a blessed life in many ways. I’ve had a lot of suffering, but one way that it’s been blessed is that I’ve had a lot of time for leisure. By leisure, I mean time that I don’t have to be involved in physical work or organizing a lot of activities (things I’m horrible at anyway.) I didn’t have to work my way through college, my mother paid for it, I’ve always had jobs as thinks like a campus minister or professor, where what you do is study and teach. Sometimes people say, “What do you read for pleasure?” I don’t understand that concept. I read what I find interesting. Now, I have to read books that I disagree with that make me terribly angry and I end up throwing across the room, but I’ve mellowed out over the years. So, I read books I don’t like that can be sort of painful to read, but then I enjoy refuting them.

Dr. Halee [15:58]

Point by point, taking them down. Someone asked if you outline before writing, and you said that you basically have the outline in your head because you’ve already thought extensively about the argument. 

Dr. Groothuis [16:17]

But I didn’t start out that way. I think about my first book, Unmasking the New Age, which came out in 1986. Interestingly, that’s been my best-selling book over the years. I had a very detailed outline that I presented to Intervarsity Press. Of course, if you do a book proposal, you need to have an outline. At that stage, I was in my late-twenties—I needed to have outlines. At this stage, I almost never do. I can have a book proposal within 30 minutes to an hour if it’s been something I’ve been researching, writing about, and praying about for years and years. At this point in my life as a writer, a lot of my ideas crystallize quickly. I’m 65, and I think the first thing I was ever published in was my junior high school newspaper called The Huskies Howl. It was album reviews because I’ve always loved writing about music and art. I liked that—this whole page was for me, and I got to do album reviews. So that got me into journalism. I was also a part of the high school newspaper called The Eagle’s Cry. My senior year, I was the editorial page editor. I thought I was a hot shot. Then I went to college and took a composition class where I got a C on my first paper. My professor said, “You have some interesting ideas, but you don’t express them very well.” I was humble enough to realize (though I wasn’t a Christian at that point) that she was right. So, I worked very hard to become a good writer in college. 

Dr. Halee [18:18]

That’s an important thing to note—you can become a good writer. It doesn’t necessarily mean that you’re a writer or you’re not. You can practice to become a great writer! One of the things that people asked that I think is hard is when I’ve taught students and also in my own writing—when I think about presenting an opposing opinion that I’m about to take down, how do you know when you’ve done enough studying to be able to represent it fairly. For example, in your recent book, Fire in the Streets, you take on Critical Race Theory. How do you know when you’re done? 

Dr. Groothuis [19:20]

That’s what painters ask a lot with painting—“when do I stop painting?” In writing, when do stop writing? When have you discharged your intellectual and literary obligations? I don’t have a simple answer for that. I think you develop a sense and a feel over time. You can write too quickly, and you don’t take opposing views serious enough, or you never let it go because there’s always another book to read; there’s always another article to read.

Maybe a story will help with this. With my first book, Unmasking the New Age (I had a previous title in mind before that), I kept researching that book, studying it, and going to new age events, and I met Becky when we were both working in campus ministry. She said, “Doug, you know more about this book than anyone in the country, I’m sure. If you start writing it, I’ll edit it for you. She gave me the kick I needed, like “stop studying and start writing.” There’s a famous line—always reading, never read. It’s true—you read some books and you think “the arguments are not adequate; it’s not researched properly.” You read other books, and you think they’re moving too slowly. So, it’s a skill you develop over time, and you need people to help you. 

Dr. Halee [21:22]

I like the concept of leisure because so many people pack their schedules so tightly that they crowd out creativity. Creativity takes time, leisure, and play. There has been a lot of research recently on the idea of play and its ability to help us with our daily problems and writing as well. I like that you incorporate leisure into your writing process.

Dr. Groothuis [22:01]

Yeah, leisure in two senses. One, I am able to do what I enjoy doing and what I believe is meaningful and helpful to other people. It’s not that I have all kinds of other obligations that take away from my writing, research, and teaching. I typically don’t. I’m so blessed. But I do find that when I’m doing something besides writing, research, and teaching, such as a long bike ride, ideas come to me. I’m just always thinking. I’m driving around in the car and thinking, “oh yeah, there’s this idea and that idea and I should write an essay on that.” My wife Kathleen says, “You just live in your head.” And I say, “Well, where else can I live?”

Dr. Halee [22:48]

That’s very similar to my dad saying, “You ask too many questions.” I’m constantly in my head. My husband knows after twenty-one years of marriage to call my name 3-4 times to get my attention. 

Dr. Groothuis [23:43]

For someone who is trying to get started in writing, you need dedicated time to do nothing but write. Don’t wait for the inspiration. Writing is more perspiration than inspiration. If inspiration comes, by all means write it down. But writing is mainly the discipline of saying, “Ok, I’ve got some time; here’s a topic—let’s work on it.” It’s not like raking leaves in the yard. With that, you can say, “Ok, I’ll take half an hour.” But say you have a 1,000-word article to write. You don’t know how long that will take. There’s no direct computation for how long it will take to write something because it is a creative process. So, you need to carve out time and develop your skills. One piece of advice I give all aspiring writers is to read good writers. Read C.S. Lewis. Read J.R. Packard. Read classic literature and emulate. My favorite little book on style is one I’ve taught for 30 years. It’s called Elements of Style by William Strunk and E.B. White. I don’t think you can do much better than that.

Dr. Halee [25:14]

I think I have several copies of that book in my bookshelf. You know, your writing has been described multiple times as fearless writing. What advice would you give to writers who want to write fearlessly? That might look different for different people because different people face different obstacles. So, what would be your advice to write fearlessly?

Dr. Groothuis [25:39]

Pursue truth—needful truth. I go by the quote I got from the great apologist Dr. Walter Martin years ago—“Controversy for the sake of controversy is sin. Controversy for the sake of the gospel is divine command. Over the years, I’ve tried to defend the Christian worldview and the ideas I think are most significant. I’ve never tried to pick a fight. I don’t like arguing actually. It’s kind of funny—a philosopher that doesn’t like arguing. But if I need to make a case for something I take to be significant, I will do so. So, find your passions in respect to truth and meaning, and pursue those with the abilities that God has given you. Be open to criticism and remember that every good writer needs a good editor. I was so blessed to have Becky editing all my work up until 2010, and I’ve taken those lessons with me.